McIntosh MCT500 + MDA200 for SACDs

[audiobill]

The Rossini is certainly TOTL, enjoy!!

[AnotherJohnson]

The Rossini is certainly TOTL, enjoy!!

That’s the irony. It is not TOTL. The Vivaldi, Vivaldi Apex, and Rossini Apex are all higher.

But the Rossini is a great taste of the high end. Lusting after more is for folks with deeper pockets than mine.

I would definitely go for the Apex upgrade before I’d spend the same money on an unknown. I’ve listened extensively to the Rossini and Rossini Apex. The upgrade would not be a pig in a poke. I chose the Rossini deliberately. The cost benefit ratio worked for me. Right now I am not jonesing for the next level. I’m still in awe of the level I’m on.

[AnotherJohnson]

After more extensive listening to a wide range of SACDs, I think the Levinson is pulling ahead. It’s just more detailed with better definition of every voice.

This was a premature evaluation. The Levinson 5101 has been broken in for a long time. Whereas the MCT500/MDA200 was pretty much brand new.

In the intervening weeks, the McIntosh transport and DAC have improved to the point where SACD bass, spatial cues, and timbre are all presented more believably than at first.

The dCS Rossini is still better than the MDA200 for streaming via the Roon Nucleus and Qobuz. The dCS Rossini is also still best for playing Red Book CDs via the MCT500.

But I can’t play SACDs through the Rossini without a dCS transport. So the MCT500 to MDA200 is my best SACD option. The Levinson 5101 is still excellent at its lower ($6700) price point.

I recently read that the actual mechanical drives in the McIntosh MCT500 transport and in the dCS Rossini transport were both sourced from Marantz.

[AnotherJohnson]

Regarding the McIntosh D1100 Reference Digital Preamp released in 2017, I talked with my McIntosh dealer today to ask about its status.

They haven’t stocked these since the initial run. But they can be ordered as they are still on the dealers’ catalog. The msrp has been raised to $8k.

Of course a 6 year old DAC with no upgrade path is “reference” just like an ARC Reference 5 is “reference.” It sounds great, but is no longer SOTA. Still a worthy component, with a lot of panache, but surpassed in absolute terms by the later and greater.

[admin]

So many great options. AJ, your overall favorite seems to be the the dCS. Do you think it would be worthwhile consideration to sell/trade in the McIntosh gear and get the dCS transport or upgrade the the Rossini to Apex level or higher dCS? It now seems like you are holding a lot of gear just to play the DSD natively off of SACDs.

[AnotherJohnson]

So many great options. AJ, your overall favorite seems to be the the dCS. Do you think it would be worthwhile consideration to sell/trade in the McIntosh gear and get the dCS transport or upgrade the the Rossini to Apex level or higher dCS? It now seems like you are holding a lot of gear just to play the DSD natively off of SACDs.

If I make any DAC changes, and I don’t have any plan to do that in the near future, then the changes would be to add the Rossini Master Clock and to upgrade the Rossini to Apex status. Or possibly all the way to the Rossini Apex Player (not a factory upgrade, but a trade).

I don’t have a lot of gear just to play DSD natively off of SACDs … I have several relatively current options for SACDs motivated by the new clarity of differences that has accrued due to component and wire changes during the last 18 months. It is like tuition that you pay to learn something.

At the moment I still have less tied up in these choices than fair market value, with the exception of the Node (which is low cost to begin with). So if I were to decide to let the Ruby and the 5101 go, they would still generate net positive cash.

It has been fascinating to hear how this system has evolved, and is evolving.

The elevation of streaming to a level competitive with the best of other formats has been the last quest.

I suspect it is possible to improve things further. But I’m at the point where moving up is now in $20k+ increments.

That’s the true question - does another $20k+ into this system yield as much enjoyment as some other target might?

I presently have about four times as much in the system as I would have ever dreamed about. Maybe 100 times more than I would have thought possible in 1975 when I bought my first component based system. In 1975 my professional salary was less than $20k/year and a 2500 ft2 house in a good neighborhood was around $50k. My first component based complete system cost less than $450 OTD. And a really good system was under $2k.

Everyone is at their own stage of this hobby. Comparisons lead to knowledge of better … even after you’re on a good plateau. You can be VERY happy at any good plateau once you’ve achieved the ABCDs:

Access to a wide range of enjoyable programs.
Believable presentation of the performances.
Convenience of your interface to the system.
Dependability of the components.

Except for B, Alexis can do these things.

[AnotherJohnson]

Just as info …

In the latest version of The McIntosh Reference Music System, as defined on the McIntosh site, they are using the DAC in the MCD12000. And it is not upgradable.

https://www.mcintoshlabs.com/products/c ... s/MCD12000

Their Reference Music System is interesting in that it appears to be all things for all people. Tube and Solid State side by side. It even includes the MEN220, now 13 years in production. The MEN220 is a Steinway Lyngdorf room correction component that they claim allows you to not worry about room treatments or speaker placement.

Linn has a similar capability. And I think Ikon (Gayle Saunders?) has too. Of course every HT system does as well,

And Martin Logan is sporting an Anthem Room Correction interface.

Of course reviews have been mixed.

[AnotherJohnson]

The McIntosh Reference Music System is presented here.

https://www.mcintoshlabs.com/systems/Reference-Music

I’ve heard several of the components, but never the whole thing. I wonder if any dealers have one set up for demos.

[admin]

That is one heck of a setup. Certainly a little outside of my budget.

[AnotherJohnson]

Just for fun, I just sent a customer service question to McIntosh to see how quickly they respond.

The question was to ask them if any dealers have this do-called reference system installed for customer demos.

[AnotherJohnson]

Just for fun, I just sent a customer service question to McIntosh to see how quickly they respond.

The question was to ask them if any dealers have this do-called reference system installed for customer demos.

I had a detailed response in my email before 8:30 am. The fellow’s name is Ryan. He named three dealers that could set it up.

[audiobill]

And I've had the same speedy response from Chuck Hinton and Ron Cornelius from McIntosh whenever I've reached out.

Also, I understand they added 20 staff in Binghamton last Fall and another 20 this Spring along with a plant addition.

They must be doing something right.....

[AnotherJohnson]

And I've had the same speedy response from Chuck Hinton and Ron Cornelius from McIntosh whenever I've reached out.

Also, I understand they added 20 staff in Binghamton last Fall and another 20 this Spring along with a plant addition.

They must be doing something right.....

I agree. McIntosh is doing many things right, at many price points.

Their entry level price points are quite reasonable. But their most expensive gear is modestly priced compared to the new offerings from their legitimate competitors.

If you want gear that is well supported, you’ve got to consider McIntosh. You can put together a heck of a good McIntosh system for the price of an ART preamp and amps.

[AnotherJohnson]

There is no substitute for listening in your own system when you’re trying to evaluate components.

After another week of listening, there are more discoveries.

One relates to the attempt to use the MCT500 and Rossini for regular CDs with a coax connection and the MCT500 and MDA200 for SACDs with the proprietary McIntosh MCT connection. It was unexpected.

If you connect the MCT500 and MDA200 with the MCT cable, the coax output from the MCT500 to the Rossini no longer works. The MCT500 digital output will only go to the next device via the MCT cable. Even if you’re playing a regular CD on the MCT500.

The Rossini is hands down better than the MDA200 for regular CDs.

So the solution has been to drop the MCT cable and forget about SACDs on the pure McIntosh combo.

Instead, I’ve gone back to the Levinson 5101 for SACDs, and the MCT500 Rossini combo via coax for regular CDs. That way I don’t have to be plugging the MCT cable in and out depending on the disk format being played.

I think this will be a stable local optimum for my purposes. I’m glad I discovered this before selling the Levinson. I’ve had offers, even though I’d not formally put it up for sale.

I’m coming around to recognizing the Levinson as an exceptional combination unit for its price point.

I think the MCT500 is a very good transport, but the difference between the Levinson and the pure McIntosh combo is small. SACDs are not the dominant disk choice here, and the convenience of not having to reroute cables for different disks trumps the minor differences for SACD presentations.

This gives an incentive to continue to look for a good deal on a dCS transport, but the new and used prices for dCS transports are a strong disincentive.