Roon Nucleus

[AnotherJohnson]

It’s not starting out well.

I followed the set up guide, plugged in power and Ethernet, started the Roon remote app.

It turns out you can only be logged into one Roon core at a time, so I logged out of the MacBook core, found the Nucleus, and logged in.

On the bright side, the free one year subscription coupon worked and my account says it is paid through March of 2024.

On the really not bright side, that was the last thing that worked as hoped.

The Roon remote on both the MacBook and the iPhone began closing immediately after launching them.

Advice from Roon, turn off fire wall. OK. Did not help. Turned it back on.

Advice from Roon: go to set up in Roon remote app to update Nucleus. No can do. Roon Remote closes as soon as it realizes it’s open.

Reloaded apps on MacBook and iPhone. No success.

Could not use either Nucleus or MacBook Roon Cores. Nothing was accessible because the Roon app would close itself immediately after it was launched.

Removed Nucleus from network and unplugged its power.

Pre-Nucleus system on MacBook began working again, although I had to “unauthorize” the unplugged Nucleus to get the MacBook based Roon Core back to functioning.

So … how do you access setup in the Roon App to troubleshoot if the problem is that the Roon App won’t stay open? It liters just vanishes as soon as the launch screen finishes and would transition to the home page were it working.

I am going to try the Roon community. Maybe there’ll be a helpful soul there who’s been through this.

Sigh ….

[AnotherJohnson]

Exact same problem is being experienced by others, independent of whether Mac or Android/PC.

https://community.roonlabs.com/t/unable ... eus/237622

This BS that “Roon is aware” is as stupid and unsatisfying as “dCS is aware.”

The companies that provide the streaming are the biggest enemies of stable excellence.

Even the Node is not immune. The first that arrived here was DOA. The second lost its WiFi reliability within a month and needed Ethernet.

The only stuff that’s been reliable (after initial problems) is the Marantz/Denon stuff. It’s the simplest, least capable, but most trouble free stuff here.

[admin]

Sorry you are having these headaches. Very frustrating. I'm not sure what advice I can offer as it seems like the actual app can't connect to the unit so you are very limited on what you can try. I'm also not familiar with the Roon ecosystem that much. Obviously Roon needs to comment on what the next steps should be and I would probably start a thread on their forums or contact them directly.

In the meantime, just on the off chance that this is some kind of network related issue, you could try taking the nucleus and phone to somebody else's home (or try it with another router if you have one lying around) to see if you can get it working like that. Perhaps it needs a firmware upgrade that may solve the issue but typically you have to get into the settings page of these devices first.

[AnotherJohnson]

I think the path forward now is to try to update the Nucleus from the running MacBook Roon implementation, and then migrate the library to the Nucleus and deauthorize the MacBook.

Instructions are given, but they are fraught with potentially destructive bifurcations.

I predict that I am several hours of futzing around before the Nucleus gets out of the neck of this bottle.

[admin]

So just so I'm clear. You can't have a nucleus and a computer with roon on the same network to use as a player? I get you would primarily use the nucleus in your stereo. But let's say you go on vacation, you can't use roon to play music on your computer?

[AnotherJohnson]

You need Roon ARC installed on the portable device AND it has to be able to see your running Roon Core from its remote location to access your library or streaming services.

Of course you can always stream remotely without Roon by running your streaming services directly, bypassing Roon.

[admin]

You can use the Nucleus for streaming services, but you still would want a way to access local files from your computer. I'm just not clear as why you wouldn't be able to play music from the nucleus, mac, or phones,... independently depending on situational requirements.

[AnotherJohnson]

You can take the Roon Core with you if it’s on your laptop.

If it’s running on your network at home, you need Roon ARC and the remote device must be able to access the running Core. If the Core is not accessible, then ARC won’t work.

If the Core is physically with you, you don’t need ARC.

Right now my problem is that Roon, like every other hardware supplier, expects the consumer to update it right out of the box. The problem, and “Roon is aware and working on it,” is that the update strategy has a glitch. The Roon Remote app crashes before you can get into set up and updates.

At least removal of the Nucleus allowed the Core on the MacBook to go back to work with a functioning Roon Remote capability.

I haven’t got time for this right now. It will be next week before I can wrestle with the Nucleus again.

Meanwhile, the MacBook installation is fully functional. So I can still use Roon as I was before the Nucleus arrived.

[admin]

AJ,

Can you get direct access to the nucleus setup by typing in the direct ip address of the nucleus on the network using any web browser (that is connected to the network). It will be 192.168.1.XXX where X is a number between 2 and 256. This may allow you to bypass using any of the roon apps on the computer or phone.

If you don't know the ip address of the nucleus, you should be able to find it by going into the router setup (192.168.1.1) and it should list it as a LAN device.

This should allow you to access the Nucleus's web administration interface. That includes manually updating the firmware.

[AnotherJohnson]

Yup. Easy as 3.14159265…

[admin]

Mine looks like this. Your router will have something similar.

For example. My Bluesound node is 192.168.1.102

Your Node and nucleus is most likely listed. If you type in the direct address to any web browser you will be taken to their web interface (both the Node or Nucleus in this case).

[AnotherJohnson]

Yes, it’s all explained on numerous help pages. Just do this, that and the other thing because we can’t be bothered selling you something that actually works out of the box WITH OUR OWN SOFTWARE.

I’ll get to it next week. This week there are other fish to fry.

I read an article that US residents are focused on streaming. But it’s not audiophile streaming. It’s Alexa, Sirius, Spotify, etc. The Japanese have turned to owning their own hard media. There is a reawakening of interest in SACDs, vinyl, even CDs. It is a joy to own, and therefore control, your programming.

Even if you’ve forced your streaming services to obey your commands, next month they will introduce new obstacles. You are at their mercy … and they are not merciful.

[admin]

I hear your frustration. And it's deserved. You spend a lot of money and it is not unreasonable to expect it to simply work.

Resurgence of vinyl is an interesting phenomena but I would not count on SACD or CD to make a comeback in any more than a niche fashion. I enjoy the collection of hard media (both audio and my laserdisc collection) but I understand that we are in a minority.

If you want to play with this nucleus issue, I'm happy to help in any way I can.

[audiobill]

Try getting a "mentor" in the Roon Community to help you through this temporary setup hassle....

[AnotherJohnson]

If you want to play with this nucleus issue, I'm happy to help in any way I can.

Thanks. I may contact you.

I’ve done all of these things at one time or another. But I don’t deal with them regularly, so there is always a relearning curve.

None of it is derivable from first principles or logic. It’s always about following some template.

One of the reasons I retired in 2016 was that senior ME students could no longer do simple mathematics or even simple arithmetic. Their whole math education had been based on learning calculator operations. They couldn’t even follow physical derivations. No regrets at getting out. It’s probably worse today.

[AnotherJohnson]

Try getting a "mentor" in the Roon Community to help you through this temporary setup hassle....

Yeah, I’ve already gone over there. It’s do-able. It’s just a PITA.

[audiobill]

Please rethink a Mac Mini M1 or M2. easy peasy, and save $1K.

[AnotherJohnson]

Not much different from running on MacBook Air with an M1 or M2 chip, No? Runs there fine.

The truth is, this is pretty much another experiment in my IT tolerance level. It’s running fine on the MacBook. But if Roon thinks the nucleus is the best possible way to strut their stuff (so they claim), I’d like to see what that is.

Frankly, the nucleus specs are not impressive as general specs, but they claim to have designed the package to fully exploit the hardware, so it’s supposed to be exceptionally fast and reliable.

So far I’m impressed… but not in a good way.

I’m hoping that when the smoke clears, I’ll think better of it. They’re mighty proud of it.

[admin]

The specs on the Nucleus and Nucleus + with their i3 and i7 CPUs and 4GB and 8GB of ram respectively is very impressive for a streaming platform. Most others are using much lower end chips that you would find in say a phone or a raspberry pi.

If anything, these specs are way more than what you need for a simple streaming platform. With a standard stream without DSP, I would be surprised if more than a small fraction of the CPU is being used. DSPs will be using the vast majority of the processing power if they are activated.

I think the current troubles are not related to the stats of the hardware. It's simply a software issue. Again, I would start with trying to log in directly via web browser and see if a firmware update is available.

[AnotherJohnson]

The problem has nothing to do with the hardware specs.

But as processors go, the Nuclei are not at the processor state of the art.

They don’t need to be. Their tasks and operations are well defined. Their layout and instructions can be optimized. And probably are.

No, this glitch is undoubtedly due to the complexity of the known tasks and an unforeseen interaction with some obscure bit of firmware or software. They’ve got to figure out what it is, and develop a patch at the least.

FWIW, the ip address of the router is on the router, so that’s the starting point.

Right now I’m busy playing SACDs on the McIntosh MCT500/MDA200. If it keeps sounding this good, I’ll be busy for several hours.

With streaming you never know what you’re going to have to deal with. I hate sitting down to listen, and then be forced into troubleshooting. It almost never happens with hard media. It is a 5% to 10% possibility with streaming at an audiophile level.