How good are the built-in phono stages in PV-era preamps??

[lectrolink]

I have always been curious to compare the phono stage in my PV8 to external phono stages to judge how good my built-in is. Just for fun,I asked for and received for Xmas a cheap-o ($80) Pro-Ject Phono Box. I hooked it up the other day and had a listen.

No surprise that it was no contest- the built-in CJ phono stage had much better tonality, more realistic timbre, and notaly much better dynamic range. Better bass control too. The Pro-Ject got the job done and was quiet and listenable, but such a clear step backward from the buil-in, that I doubt I will listen to it again. The gain on the Pro-ject must be lower, since I noticed I had to set the volume control quite a bit higher than with the built-in for normal listening volume.

My question is, does anyone have experience knowing how high the bar must be set to surpass the built-in phono stage in a unit like the PV8? What have people used in modern phono stages that surpassed the built-in?

[admin]

My opinion is that they were really good for that time period. CJ has moved away from integrated phono stages to externals. So one big issue is that these older phono stages were excellent, but now they are decades old. So you start seeing degradation of the components and other issues pop up.

I think I would rather have a new TEAx phono preamp than an integrated old CJ phono stage, but I would rather have an old integrated phono stage than some cheap Chinese made phono preamp.

[AnotherJohnson]

I agree with Admin regarding the TEAx phono stages.

I had PV5, PV8, and PV11. I liked them all, but the 5 was more colored than the 8, and the 11 was best to my ears. I ran them with MM and HOMC cartridges.

I’ve had both TEA phono preamps. Also phono preamps from Audio Research (4 models), Linn, NAD, Rega, and others (Krell, Marantz, Cambridge Audio, Scott, McIntosh etc). People like Manley, Sutherland, Soundsmith, and many others too.

Your ears have to be your guide. You can’t go strictly by dollars because systems matching and condition are very important. But if I were to comment, it would be to suggest that $2k would be the minimum price of admission.

FWIW, there’s a TEA1B with the transformer upgrade offered for $4300 at the Music Room as I write this. It’s probably got more gain than you would like though, especially the transformer channel.

My present is the ARC REF 3 and it’s the one that has won my comparos here. I have not felt the need to upgrade it to SE status, but some reviewers have suggested it’s worthwhile.