Esoteric SACD digital playback systems

[Big Dog RJ]

Mmm, I see.

Very correct about the transport mechanism and DACs chip set. The Esoteric gear is on a different planet! Such a major improvement over the Mac on every level you can possibly think of, I never knew it would be that far a margin.

Just to experience that, the particular unit I have at the moment, K07Xs, is only at the bottom of spectrum. However, since they do a handful of players within this range before going to the top of the line stuff, the standards are well set in very model, nothing flinches, no compromises, exceptional build quality top to bottom, inside out.

As of the Mac it went off to a very deserving music lover, and I looked after it really well. Even though it's nearly 11 yrs old, it still looked brand new. I included a nice pair of Analysis interconnects that I wasn't using. It served well and was a very enjoyable player for what it offered.

I think at this stage, my upgrade path will come to a pause for now, otherwise I'll be thrown into that infamous dog house, and the wifey won't give me any bones... it will be one sad doggy. So, might as well just sit back and enjoy those fine tunes!

Cheers to digital!
Woof woof! RJ

[admin]

I just went back and read my posts. I called the Mac player "cheap consumer gear." I take this back. This is not accurate and I am not sure why I said that... I think I must have been tired when I wrote the comment.

What I really meant to say is that Mac media players have a history of taking components from mass produced units from other manufacturers and re-branding it. I've mentioned on here that I collect Laserdiscs and back in the 90's Mac released their own Laserdisc player. This was pretty much the only Laserdisc player from a "high end" manufacturer. But the thing was, it was nothing more than a Pioneer CLD-97 with a new front plate and an additional audio decoder output board. Now the CLD-97 is a solid player (I have two myself) but the Mac player is basically a Pioneer player that they sold at any big box store. But it certainly does not have higher quality components than any other player out there.

In all fairness, I am not intimately familiar with how Mac is handling their players these days but it's very possible that they are re-branding some of these components with mostly cosmetic overhauls and very minor internal changes. This would certainly explain why the Esoteric is on a different level. Just my 2 cents.

[AnotherJohnson]

All true. Anything that involves a mechanical transport is rebadged or incorporated into an otherwise Mac design.

As an example of others doing the same thing, look at how many used Oppo drives in order to avoid having to build their own. Oppo’s folding up shop led to widespread speculation that CD players were going to disappear.

Mac and Levinson both badge turntables, arms, and cartridges made by others as their own.

The advantage of a Mac CD player is that Mac entered into a contractual relationship with the manufacturer which defined what they would accept... this is worth something, and a reassurance to Mac CD player owners.

You are correct that it is not cheap consumer gear ... it is usually the best that Mac could negotiate at a price point they thought their market would bear.

[Big Dog RJ]

Well nearly a month has passed since the last episode... Esoteric drama and what should be best and what is not...

I was wondering whether I should post this note under the Luxman tab but I thought I'd post here since this is where the changes and adjustments were made after those comments.

After taking the comments positively to alter a few things offered by professionals, and wow is this thing sounding superb especially now. I also had the pleasure of having the Luxman D03x for three days running. It will be returned tomorrow Monday arvo on may way to work.

The unit arrived on Friday morning and was set up using the Aux input on the CT5. I wasn't around for initial setup, so this was the temporary installation done and a few SACD's were running for several hours before I headed back. I then connected the D03x to the proper CD input on the preamp but noticed the Aux input made no real difference, so I plugged in the Esoteric into that and left it there for the rest of the AB comparison. The chappy told me that this thing required around 500hrs to really shine, which he had sort of reached before he had ordered the top of the line Luxman D10x player. Also mentioned to give it at least 3-4 hrs before making any judgements. Heck, even my Esoteric K07xs requires more than a few 100hrs or so, and it hasn't even reached half that as yet...

Anyway, straight off the bat, the first thing I noticed was the ultra quietness of the D03x tray, it just glides in and out, zero noise, superb! It's actually a marvel to experience this. It had about 48hrs prior on it plus a few more hrs around 4hrs running before I started to do some comparisons. I must say it always impressed, there was never a dull moment. It had a beautiful warmth to it and good sense of balance, and I could listen for endless hours. On the second day, which was Sat, I compared both side by side. Although on certain recordings the D03x seemed a bit recessed in the mids and highs top end extension, the bass and most LF's seemed very well controlled. It had a nice overall feel to it, as I sat there and listened nothing I could flaw. It handled most recordings extremely well, the only ones weren't so great are the ones that weren't great recordings to begin with! So I didn't play any of that stuff.

Third and final day, which is now (Sun) I'm listening to the K07xs and I can clearly understand why I prefer it, not just because I have it but based on three main points it has developed a synergy in my particular system:

1. It's overall sense of balance matches perfectly well with the rest of the gear. The synergy is perfect, hence don't want to change that unless the improvements were significant.

2. The midrange is more open and extends into a different dimension once this thing has really warmed up. Plus, the K07xs hasn't yet fully reached its peak. So still good things to come...

3. The top end frequency extension is greater on the K07xs compared to the D03x but that's in my particular set-up, so obviously other's systems would vary.

As for now, I've powered down the K07xs and listening to Tracy Chapman, Norah Jones and Holly Cole on the D03x and it's marvellous! When I say powered down I meant dimed the display to off... not fully shut off but then the K07xs has a really cool feature where if there's no signal for a certain period of time, the unit completely shuts itself off.

Really enjoying it as much as possible before heading back to my good mate tomorrow. The only issue was, he was not willing to lend his D10x being top of the line, for three days... I can certainly understand that. I'm sure that unit would take the performance envelope even further but comparing that with the one I have would be unfair. In that case it would have to be the K01XD series, now we're talking some serious gear!

Anyway, to summarise: both of these digital playback systems offer very high quality reference standards, and both are just as good. It all depends in what type of system they're installed and in what type of application they're used for. As separate DACs, transports or stand alone digital players, they're very versatile and have all the necessary features you're looking for in various types of digital formats. I guess sky's the limit!

At the moment listening to this album by Patricia Barber- Modern Cool and Live in Paris on the K07xs, outstanding!

So cheers to the Luxman D03x, one mighty fine combination indeed!
Cheers, and a mighty woof!

[AnotherJohnson]

Sounds like a great activity for us sound obsessed guys (I include myself).

Last week I spent a couple of evenings with the Marantz SA-KI listening to some of my favorite red book CDs.

SACDs on the SA-KI are close to my vinyl system for realism.
Red book CDs are exceptionally good ... but not as close to the live feeling that I get from my best vinyl. I have some recordings on multiple formats ... vinyl, audiophile vinyl, CD, and SACD. Direct comparison usually orders them from best to less than best as vinyl, SACD, CD, and audiophile vinyl.

You can’t do better than get close to what’s on the master tape. And I’ve said before, some of most technically rewarding work was done by Rudy Van Gelder, and later by Bob Ludwig.

The last few nights I’ve been back digging into the large body of Rudy Van Gelder recorded jazz from the 50’s and into the 60’s. These are nearly all mesmerizing on my vinyl playback system.

[admin]

Nice review and comparison. It's nice to see these high end players incorporating other inputs such as USB as they can double as media players and stand alone DACS. It really makes them versatile components beyond simply spinning CD's.

[Big Dog RJ]

Finally managed to get to ARR (audiophile reference recordings) on Sat, it was a fairly decent 1hr drive to the store but on the way back nearly 2hrs! The silly gps took me on a different route back home through the mcg! Richmond was playing so it was a big footy match and the crowd was massive... hence the 2hr drive through.

Anyway, I returned with 10 fine recordings, 6 on LP and 4 on CD. The LPs comprised mostly of Yuko Mabuchi Trio albums vol 2 and vol 1&2 playing tunes from Miles Davis. Accompanied by a young trumpeter name JJ Kirkpatrick or someone.. he's marvellous! Fine recording on Yarlung label 45rpm 180gm, very nice.

Then these particular 3 CDs were a fine pick from Charles himself (ARR store owner). Ultra HD on 32bit masters, and one done on K2 HD 24bit, not only are these CDs fantastic but also the musicians. J Lossiuer (think I spelled it wrong) plays a unique version of Bolero with a jazz twist, superb! Call it classic jazz or jazz classical, it's an unusual experience. Very enjoyable I must say, every single track was an absolute pleasure.

Then on Telarc we have Andre Previn playing with Ray Brown and Joe Pass, two jazz legends! Another superb recording by FIM & Telarc with the expertise of Winston Ma and the Four/five group formed by those three masters, Bishop, Fredrick and Moore. The Happy Coat album is what I'm listening to now whiles typing this, equally superb! I think I'm going to be up for a while, especially after we set the clock back an hour. They usually say that gives us 1 extra hour of sleep since day light saving ends. For me it's rather an extra hour of the finest music!

I highly recommend these labels and of course the high quality recordings on sacd/dsd that are available. I think these FIM labels mastered off 32bit UHD mastering is something extraordinary.
The Esoteric digital gear picks up every detail with the perfect balance, it's a marvellous combination.
I'm sure on any high quality digital playback systems these FIM UHD discs will sound fantastic!

Cheers to FIM!
Big WOOF RJ

[admin]

Nice haul! Well worth the 3 hour drive in my opinion.

[Big Dog RJ]

Over the last few days, I got the Esoteric setup tech to come over and do some fine tuning with the DACs and filters on board, oh my goodness gracious! What a superb combination these settings are.

There are three main modes from M1 - M3, with three separate digital filters ranging from F1 - F3, plus up sampling to 16x over. It gets very intriguing as you try out different quality recordings. And as Admin rightly pointed out, not all audiophile recordings are made perfectly.

So as we sat there and tried various settings, which took 2-3 days, we finally agreed on M1 filter 2, with 8x sampling. This gave the most natural tonality with a perfect sense of balance, not too much of anything. Smooth extended bass that dips well beyond the printed specs of the CLX's, and when such bass is called for, it delivers with bullet speed and agility. The bass is not as deep as those 15inch drivers in the Ren15a's or Neoliths but it has plenty of LF detail.

The highs are silky high and well extended, goes to superb extension. The magic is in the midrange, absolutely palpable and just glorious to experience, for endless hours. Hence, our session finished at 4:30am! This morning.

Although the rest of the household was asleep, we really didn't open up levels too loud, it wasn't necessary simply because you can adjust the sound just like focusing a camera lense, everything falls into place perfectly.

Superb stuff when you get this balance right, just sheer brilliance! Enjoy those fine tunes!
Big WOOF!!! RJ

[Rubicon15]

I currently own a DV-2b CD player. It has worked flawlessly. I am starting to stream CD quality music and would still like to maintain my vintage player. From what I have read, replacement parts are very limited and in some cases not available. If possible, I would like to refurbish the DV-2b now. What if anything can be done to maintain this incredible player for years to come?

[admin]

Great player. I think the best thing you could do is to make sure the player is in clean environment. Don't let too much dust accumulate. Keep humidity at recommended levels. Allow for good ventilation. Power protection (or unplug when not in use). Otherwise, not much more to do to extend life.

[Rubicon15]

What about the optical laser head and the belt. I think these parts are readily available. I’m definitely not an expert but I have read that lasers can wear over time. My unit doesn’t seem to have any issues read CDs. Should I consider replacing any of the parts or just do as you previously mentioned? I replaced the tubes a few years ago. Luckily I live in Austin, TX and we have relatively low humidity.

[admin]

I wouldn't really replace anything that is not broken. I'm not very familiar with CD player repair. However, my other hobby is laserdisc players. I can tell you that with laserdisc players, the first things to usually fail are the actual mechanisms for movement in the player. So things like the rubber belts that move the trays in and out or the reading head. They start to slip or drive mechanisms with plastic gears tend to wear out. The lubrication gets dry so sometimes those things need a little attention.

[Rubicon15]

What is the best type of lubrication to use on the gears? I agree with your belt comment. I can tell mine slips at times. I have read about some people boiling their belt to clean and shrink it. I would prefer to replace old rubber with new. I found a replacement at webspareparts.com. At $17 us it’s a little pricey. Unfortunately, the company is located overseas. Thoughts? I sincerely appreciate your time and help.

[admin]

You can use silicone based grease for plastic gears. If you just do a search for "plastic gear grease" on amazon, you find many suitable products. They will usually write "safe for plastic" in the description. As for "creative ways" to rejuvenate old rubber, I don't know but replacement would definitely be the ideal solution. I know $17 sounds like a lot for a small piece of rubber, but if it gives you another 30 years of proper operation, it may be worth it. Shipping overseas wouldn't deter me if it's from a reputable company. I have bought electronic components from overseas many times without issue.

[AnotherJohnson]

I wouldn't really replace anything that is not broken. I'm not very familiar with CD player repair. However, my other hobby is laserdisc players. I can tell you that with laserdisc players, the first things to usually fail are the actual mechanisms for movement in the player. So things like the rubber belts that move the trays in and out or the reading head. They start to slip or drive mechanisms with plastic gears tend to wear out. The lubrication gets dry so sometimes those things need a little attention.

It seems to be the same for CD and SACD. The mechanical transport is the weak spot.

[Big Dog RJ]

G'day Rubicon15,

What an outstanding CD player! I had the exact same one, which we used in our primary reference system. Comprised of the mighty Premier 8A monoblocks, original ART preamp, and the DV2B. Main speakers at the time were the Apogee Diva's.

I used two of these units, simply because the first one went bust within the first few months! The transport mechanism failed along with the optical unit. It basically suffered from what is termed as a tropical meltdown. At the time living on a tropical island with a very high level of humidity (89-90%) didn't really help with such highend gear. CJ apologised and promptly sent over a brand new unit. This one was slightly modded for tropical climates, such that certain areas of intricate mechanism were sealed. Preventing those tropical climes from creeping in... Later on we obtained the separate DAC and the DV2B was used as a transport unit. This dedicated digital playback system gave us greater control and increased the lifespan of both units, such that I used it well after I shut down the business and migrated to Aus. So the DV2B was in service from 1998 to 2005.

The first thing that generally goes off in any of these older units are the belts. They need to be replaced. Then there's the laser unit, which gets weak after about the 8-9 year mark. It takes longer for the disc to read. It should read within the first few seconds after loading. Skipping and not reading properly is whole other issue, which can also involve both the laser unit and transport mechanism. In which case both need replacing.

The tubes in the DV2B can last forever, and it's a versatile player such that it has a built-in ladder controlled volume level. This can be controlled from the remote, the DV2B has a high enough output to drive the digital signal directly from the DV2B to the power amplifier. With this installation you can omit the need of the preamp. It sounds so much clearer and a special purity in the sound. However, that's only if the preamp is somewhat highly coloured and not so engaging. Using the DV2B directly adds far more clarity, simply because the audio playback chain has become simpler...

Only word of ***caution*** whenever the DV2B is powered off and powered on again, by default settings that built-in volume control is always set to high/ full volume!!! So before you play any tunes whatsoever, you need to immediately lower the levels before hitting play! Otherwise, you'll experience the 4th of July!

OTOH, for obviously having different sources, CD, tape, LP, tuner, and Aux, for switching a preamp is definitely needed. Plus all of CJ's preamps that are linestage designed are superb, and add great depth and dimensionality to the overall presentation.

That's basically about it all you can do for the DV2B. Just keep those belts swinging, and laser tracking and you're good to go! Also keep an eye on the caps, the DV2B has a solid power supply with a whole lot of caps. It was probably the most enjoyable digital playback system I've ever used!

Cheers mate, and do enjoy those fine tunes.
Big WOOF!!! RJ

[Rubicon15]

I sincerely appreciate everyone’s thoughts and advice. I have a belt on order and may check out an optical unit for sale on Amazon. Quite frankly, I surprised I found two sources for an optical unit. Luckily, mine appears to be working fine. When my belt arrives, I plan on looking at the optical unit. I honestly don’t know how hard it is to install a new optical unit. Any additional advice will be greatly appreciated. Thanks again!

[roberto]

Hola Rubicon15,
I recommend to you to take your cd to an electronic workshop for changing the optical unit. Sometimes it is needed to do adjustments. And these adjustments are done with the aid of an oscilloscope. The bandwidth of the oscilloscope should be above 200MHz. Also, some optical units come with a PC Jumper that must be removed. You have to know how to located this jumper, otherwise, the optical block will not work.

The optical unit is not plug and play. You must have prior experience with these type of electronics, otherwise you could burn the new unit.

Sorry if these are bad news for you. If you do have the skills, remember to use the Sony CD for adjusting the laser beam. Here is the link for this cd:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/114761860089?h ... SwmNZgcqNL

Happy listening!

[Big Dog RJ]

That is spot on! Sound advice! From our very good mate, Robbo.

The DV2B, pretty much like every other digital playback gear, will require some adjustments, and without the proper tools this can't be done. If you can do this from home with all the required gear & tools on hand, then go for it.

Otherwise, I would send it across to an expert who has dealt with precision electronics.

Cheers, RJ