subwoofer

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ariedesaint
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subwoofer

Post by ariedesaint »

New here and just introduced myself :)
Just a question of course.
I play with the Cav 45 and the Harbeths HL5+ and would like to add a subwoofer
After reading this, it turns out to be more difficult than I thought.
Does anyone have experience with the Cav 45 and how to connect a sub and if so, which one?

Thank you in advance!
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admin
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Re: subwoofer

Post by admin »

You can add a sub in a number of ways and depending on the connection options of the sub. As there is no "sub out" specifically on the CAV45 options including running it between the speaker cables or using some intermediary device that can create a sub channel. I would probably recommend the former vs the latter in just about all cases.

Now the question that I would ask is, do you really need a sub in the system? The Harbeths should be putting out substantial bass. Have you tried positioning the speaker as this can often significantly change the frequency response. Often moving it closer into corners can amplify the low end.

If you are still set on subwoofers, I should probably ask what is your price range?
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Main stereo: ART Amplifier and ET7s2. 2nd stereo: PV-14L and MV-55. Previously Owned: PF2 preamp, Evolution 2000 Amp, PV-12AL preamp, D/A-2b Vacuum-Tube Digital Processor.
ariedesaint
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Re: subwoofer

Post by ariedesaint »

Hi Admin,

Thanks for your quick response.
I am convinced that even if your speakers have good bass, a sub adds something.
Bigger stage..supporting voices..air...etc
My biggest question is actually whether I can use the High-Level Neutrik Speakon connection with the CAV 45 and whether the loudspeaker outputs of the CAV are suitable for this.

I cannot place my speakers in the corners of the room, they are isolated about 1.5 meters from the surrounding walls.
Budget is around 1500 euros.

Thanks for your response and this is a nice forum :)
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Re: subwoofer

Post by admin »

Well, you are right in that a sub will add "something." The question is whether that will augment a lacking low end or simply add distortion by increasing the bass above intended amounts. I think there are two aspects to look at when making this choice.

1) Is the low end really deficient? That can objectively be measured. A calibration mic and software like REW can be utilized to run a frequency sweep and it will pretty much tell you where the low end is (or is not) dropping off. If it truly is, and speaker placement is not possible, then adding a sub is a viable solution.

2) Do you just want more low end despite the fact that it may already be accurate? I will speak from my personal experience. I have two independent setups in my listening room. A 2 channel for my music, and a 7.1 system for home theater. I use a sub in my home theater system and I actually have it calibrated to be above a completely linear frequency response. Why you may ask? Well, very simple. My wife and I watch a lot of action/sci-fi content and we actually enjoy the rumble of those big explosions, light sabers clashing,... etc. I know that I am introducing distortion into how the original soundtrack was mastered and that's ok. It's a calculated and wanted distortion. But in my serious music listening which is done at more reasonable volume levels,... absolutely not. I want that pure as possible to the recording.

Ok, so those are the two factors and I would go through the "hassle" of finding out which group you are in.

I would recommend this calibration mic if you don't already have one: https://www.minidsp.com/products/acoust ... B4QAvD_BwE

If you do decide to go the sub way there are countless choices. I think Margin Logan really makes some wonderful subs so I would look at those if you have the opportunity. In the US, I think Hsu Research gives amazing bang for your buck when it comes to subs and I use one of their VTF-15H's in my home theater setup. If looking for a very detailed and subtle enhancement, I would maybe even look at the Magnepan DWM bass panel.

What I don't recommend is putting a cheap sub in the system as at the end of the day, the sub becomes your speaker and you don't want a quality mismatch between the sub and the rest of the speakers. Rotten grapes will spoil the entire fruit salad.
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ariedesaint
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Re: subwoofer

Post by ariedesaint »

Hi Admin,

thank you for your time and the good tips...I will get started with it.
Did you have an answer to the question whether I can connect the CJ to the High-Level Neutrik Speakon connection without any problems?
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Re: subwoofer

Post by admin »

I'm not that familiar with the Neutrik Speakon but isn't that a connection that you attach the speaker wires from an amp? If so, I don't see why not.
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Re: subwoofer

Post by Joe Appierto »

I could definitely be wrong on this but there are no CJ amplifiers, integrateds, etc that have speakon connectors. CJ uses standard 5 way binding posts.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speakon_connector

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ariedesaint
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Re: subwoofer

Post by ariedesaint »

Joe Appierto wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 12:15 pm I could definitely be wrong on this but there are no CJ amplifiers, integrateds, etc that have speakon connectors. CJ uses standard 5 way binding posts.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speakon_connector

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High-Level Neutrik Speakon connection are the connections on the subwoofer
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Re: subwoofer

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At the end of the day the Neutrik Speakon connectors are just speaker cable terminations that combine both +/- terminations into a convenient plug format

I probably need to back up and understand why you would want to go this route? Subwoofers will more than likely have regular +/- connectors for the speaker cables so why even go with the complication of these Neutrik Speakon connectors?

Also, you will still need an extra pair of speaker cables from the sub to the speakers if you want to put the sub in the signal path.
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Re: subwoofer

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admin wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 5:09 pm At the end of the day the Neutrik Speakon connectors are just speaker cable terminations that combine both +/- terminations into a convenient plug format

I probably need to back up and understand why you would want to go this route? Subwoofers will more than likely have regular +/- connectors for the speaker cables so why even go with the complication of these Neutrik Speakon connectors?

Also, you will still need an extra pair of speaker cables from the sub to the speakers if you want to put the sub in the signal path.

Hi Admin,

This is how REL recommends it for their subwoofers.
They supply a cable that you connect to your speaker post
and on the sub.
I mainly asked the question because a friend of mine said he wasn't sure if the CJ could handle that...
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Re: subwoofer

Post by admin »

I see. I don't know if you watched these videos but probably worthwhile: https://rel.net/blog/2018-01-04/how-to/ ... ct-my-rel/

Again, I would still go back to step 1 and really determine if a sub is needed in the setup. That's just me. :D
-admin
Home Theater in Member Gallery
Main stereo: ART Amplifier and ET7s2. 2nd stereo: PV-14L and MV-55. Previously Owned: PF2 preamp, Evolution 2000 Amp, PV-12AL preamp, D/A-2b Vacuum-Tube Digital Processor.
ariedesaint
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Re: subwoofer

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admin wrote: Tue Oct 03, 2023 6:35 am I see. I don't know if you watched these videos but probably worthwhile: https://rel.net/blog/2018-01-04/how-to/ ... ct-my-rel/

Again, I would still go back to step 1 and really determine if a sub is needed in the setup. That's just me. :D
Thanks for listening and your advice:)
I get this week a loaner from a friend(REL T9i)
keep you posted of it works or not.
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